Harry Potter

Jimenem · Post by **Jimenem** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 7:38 pm

Hmm. . . interesting concept. But does it work in the physics J.K.R. has set up for us. . . can a wizard truly loose his powers?? Never heard of it happening before. (Voldemort never lost his powers he was just drained of life. and stipped of a body.) Good Idea but not exactly plausible. . . Your on the right track though. .. Don't be discouraged.

I've got a theory. . . it's pretty popular one. But it's also a very sad one.

Harry and Voldemort are connected, because I believe Harry is a Horcrux. (Why else would he have a scar?? The Avada Kedavra curse leaves NO MARK.) In order to kill voldemort EVERY horcrux must be destroyed! Including. . . Harry

. I pray that I'm wrong.

omnipresence · Post by **omnipresence** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 7:52 pm

Well think of my theory as exhausting out his powers. That might be more realistic.
What do you think of Snape?
I think there must have been another reason why Dumbledore trusted him.
Does hehave a huge plan all worked out, good or bad.?

Jimenem · Post by **Jimenem** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 7:55 pm

Ok, I want to expand on this whole Lupin is James theory. . .I'm up for oppsition if anyone disagree'sLets discuss:

This is my favorite theory, because it seems the most probable to me, and I think the payoff for Harry would be the greatest. Since he lost his "parents" and his surrogate father Sirius. Discovering his real dad living inside his good friend would be a strong emotional reveal near the end of the story. Here are the main points supporting the theory. I've taken these from the Ultimate Unofficial Guide to Harry Potter:

How did Dumbledore(DD) get James' Invisibility Cloak, and how did Hagrid get the key to the Potter's vault? Implication is that James/Lupin gave them to DD.

Unlke everyone else, Lupin never stared at Harry's scar or mentioned his eyes or resemblance to James (when he met him the first time.) Lupin acts like he already knows Harry. (PoA - Chapter 5)

Lupin seems to be able to read Harry's mind (PoA - chapter 8]

Harry tells Lupin that when a dementor gets near him, he hears his mum being murdered by Voldemort. On hearing this, Lupin had made "a sudden motion with his arm, as though to grip Harry's shoulder, but thought better of it." (Chapter 10) [There's no reason why Lupin should stop himself from just gripping Harry's arm unless he wants to distance himself emotionally from Harry.]

Trelawney said that Lupin "positively fled when I offered to crystal gaze for him" (Chapter 11) [He's obviously afraid of exposing something besides being a werewolf - since the whole staff already knew that.]

When Harry tells Lupin he is hearing his mum's voice louder, Lupin looks "paler than usual." Harry then tells Lupin how he hears his dad's voice for the first time trying to hold off Voldemort so his mother could escape. "'You heard James?' said Lupin in a strange voice." (Chapter 12)[A strange voice. .. hmm]

Professor Lupin, who was "both shaken and pleased," comes over to congratulate Harry on his spectacular Patronus. (Chapter 13) [Shaken? Maybe he was shaken from seeing his own Patronus/animagus - the Stag.]

"I certainly don't want Harry dead..." "An odd shiver passed over his face." (Chapter 17) [That's not just a teacher or friend saying that.]

Lupin: "Now that we could all transform." (Chapter 18] [ Why wouldn't he say "Now that they could all transform"?

Lupin has "no hesitation" about what Harry's father would think (Chapter 18] [Why is he so sure about what Harry's father would think?]

Lupin's first name is Remus - the legendary wolf-child who was murdered by his brother or his brother's followers (such as Pettigrew?)

Harry's father, James, is now stuck inside the body of one of his closest (but dead) friends. James is now, for all intents, Remus Lupin (complete with werewolf transformation.)

He is unable to reveal his identity(especially now that Voldemort is back) and is paranoid that his own emotions will make him weak and he will let the truth slip. He so badly wants to touch his son, but he doesn't dare.

James and Lupin, using a Switching Spell, probably performed by Lily, switched identities as one last precaution to protect the Potter line. Remember that Voldemort wants to extinguish all Potters. The real story behind this is still unknown,

omnipresence · Post by **omnipresence** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 8:27 pm

Well its a very good theory but I think I may have found some holes in it. I will state which points I agree with and which I dont.

How did Dumbledore(DD) get James' Invisibility Cloak, and how did Hagrid get the key to the Potter's vault? Implication is that James/Lupin gave them to DD. - I agree

Unlke everyone else, Lupin never stared at Harry's scar or mentioned his eyes or resemblance to James (when he met him the first time.) Lupin acts like he already knows Harry. (PoA - Chapter 5) - True but not entirely suggestive

Lupin seems to be able to read Harry's mind (PoA - chapter 8] - He could be good at legilemency

Harry tells Lupin that when a dementor gets near him, he hears his mum being murdered by Voldemort. On hearing this, Lupin had made "a sudden motion with his arm, as though to grip Harry's shoulder, but thought better of it." (Chapter 10) [There's no reason why Lupin should stop himself from just gripping Harry's arm unless he wants to distance himself emotionally from Harry.]
It is possible but he may have wanted to reveal a different secret than being Harry Father but thaught better of it

Trelawney said that Lupin "positively fled when I offered to crystal gaze for him" (Chapter 11) [He's obviously afraid of exposing something besides being a werewolf - since the whole staff already knew that.
He may have been scared that a secret could have been revealed, the same one that he almost revealled to harry as he grabed his arm

When Harry tells Lupin he is hearing his mum's voice louder, Lupin looks "paler than usual." Harry then tells Lupin how he hears his dad's voice for the first time trying to hold off Voldemort so his mother could escape. "'You heard James?' said Lupin in a strange voice." (Chapter 12)[A strange voice. .. hmm]

Professor Lupin, who was "both shaken and pleased," comes over to congratulate Harry on his spectacular Patronus. (Chapter 13) [Shaken? Maybe he was shaken from seeing his own Patronus/animagus - the Stag.

It is possible but may also be coincidental

"I certainly don't want Harry dead..." "An odd shiver passed over his face." (Chapter 17) [That's not just a teacher or friend saying that.] I agree

Lupin: "Now that we could all transform." (Chapter 18] [ Why wouldn't he say "Now that they could all transform"?He may have said this because they were all friends and he could transform too so he had to mention himself

Harry's father, James, is now stuck inside the body of one of his closest (but dead) friends. James is now, for all intents, Remus Lupin (complete with werewolf transformation.)That would be so if he was inside Lupins body, I cant help feeling that its a bit far fetched for Rowling

He is unable to reveal his identity(especially now that Voldemort is back) and is paranoid that his own emotions will make him weak and he will let the truth slip. He so badly wants to touch his son, but he doesn't dare.That would be so if the theory is correct

James and Lupin, using a Switching Spell, probably performed by Lily, switched identities as one last precaution to protect the Potter line. Remember that Voldemort wants to extinguish all Potters. The real story behind this is still unknown,The reason is still unknown at the end of book 6. I feel that if it were so we would know by now.

omnipresence · Post by **omnipresence** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 8:28 pm

I hope I havent been too critical. I like debating these sort of things. You have certainly developed a good theory nontheless.

KC8t80 · Post by **KC8t80** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 8:28 pm

WOW!! I should really start reading the books soon.

omnipresence · Post by **omnipresence** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 8:46 pm

Yeah they are wonderfull. But you just have to have a lot of free time to go throught them.

Jimenem · Post by **Jimenem** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 10:19 pm

You haven't been too critical I said I wanted to hear from the opposition. But I do have a rebuttal. . . In the world of Harry Potter. . . there are four rules:

1: If she repeats it, she MEANS it.
2: If she suddenly interrupts something she hiding a key clue!
3: There's no such thing as a coinsidence.
4: NEVER take a characters word for it.
4a: Hermione is normally right (except when she's emotional.)
4b: Ron's normally wrong (except when he's joking.)

So taken into account the no coincidence rule, your argument to the "shaken and pleased" point can't hold up.
Another secret like what?????? Maybe his secret really is that he's James.

I agree where some of them are not entirely suggestive.

J.K.R. is telling a story about a mistreated orphan going to school to learn wizardry, pictures move and time travel is possible . . . you said what about 'farfetched'?

Ooh, this is fun. I've got another one for you when we're done here.

fluffy · Post by **fluffy** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 10:54 pm

yawn..................lol

fluffy

Jimenem · Post by **Jimenem** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 11:03 pm

You know you wanna catch pottermania. . . c'mon admit it.

quirky · Post by **quirky** » Tue Dec 20, 2005 11:09 pm

You MUST put pottermania on the sniglet thread.

OH....and......yawn.

omnipresence · Post by **omnipresence** » Wed Dec 21, 2005 7:37 am

Good points there.
I have had an Idea about what the secret might have been, Remus Lupin might have a brother. I think this because of the Roman story of Romulus and Remus. In the tale the two brothers had to fight against each other to controll Itally. This might mean that lupin did not want to reveal to tralawney that he had a brother(Death Eater brother)or relation that he was not telling anybody about.

What I ment about the idea being too far fetched was that JK herself has dubbed claims that Dumbledore was Harrys as farfetched so I cant imagine her not keeping that rule when it comes to Lupin.
When Lupin looks shaken after seeing Harrys patronus it is entirely possible that Lupin was amazed to see such a good patronus at an early age. It is also possible that he may have been surprised to see James' patronus, this does not mean Lupin is James.

In Harry Potter there are people that you cant trust, like Snape and Voldemort. On the other had you can trust people like Dumbledore. Lupin was in the order of the phoenix. Dumbledore must have trusted Lupin. He has not shown signes of being good at oclumency so he has got nothing to hide. Snape was good at it and so became a member.
Considering these facts it can mean three things.
Lupin has got nothing to hide.
Lupin is good at oclumency.
Lupin is harrys father and Dumbledore has gained Lupins trust because of that.

BTW I am not discounting your theory. However it would be great for us both to make a bulletproof theory. That is why I am highlighting these points. I want to close all gaps.

Jimenem · Post by **Jimenem** » Wed Dec 21, 2005 6:26 pm

No I understand completely where your coming from. . . But I feel sad to have wasted this much effort on a theory that has been disproved.

I found out thismorning, that J.K.R. ans already disproved this theory on her website. . .

Ahh so we must move on to another one. . .

I'm gonna bring up the "slight look of triumph on DD face" when Harry told him that Voldy used his blood to get a new body at the end of GoF.

I have a theory. . . but you go first

omnipresence · Post by **omnipresence** » Wed Dec 21, 2005 6:31 pm

Ok well make a new theory and I'll be happy to give you my opinion about it.

omnipresence · Post by **omnipresence** » Wed Dec 21, 2005 6:35 pm

I'll make my own up also. It may take some time though, as I have not read the books for some time.